Comments on: Northern Illinois University and Others; We Need Concealed Carry Laws!

By: 406

406 — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 05:30:24 +0000

Sevesteen, this is 406. Good copy.

I did some looking, and Utah’s code is on the web. This section:
http://tinyurl.com/2yzmm6
Says what you said it said. It’s interesting that the only place on campuses of higher education where lawful carry can be prohibited is the one place on campus designated as an official education hearing room, and then it is only prohibited while the designated location is in actual use as a hearing room for that educational institution.

How very interesting. A law that actually makes sens regarding CCW!

Thanks for pointing that out for us! It’s a model many states could use.

406, OUT

By: sevesteen

sevesteen — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:34:56 +0000

406–I believe Utah is one of the few states that both allows licensed CCW on campus and preempts the schools from banning licensed CCW.

By: philosophicalcop

philosophicalcop — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:43:36 +0000

406 – you should start your own blog! Excellent points all. I had saved that story for a post this morning, so with your permission I am putting it up now.

Also I couldn’t agree more on the OPSEC comment. If people were just more aware, half of this problem might be fixed.

By: 406

406 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:34:33 +0000

The website I mentioned in my first comment above is interesting. Good info. When you sign up for their email newsletter, there’s what appears at first blush to be a VERY good publication they offer you in PDF form. It’s a 12 chapter, 11MB document titled “The Armed Citizen Solution.” It seems both very informative and very practical.

One of the issues addressed – and one on which we might want to spend some time in a separate topic – is the issue of situational awareness. That issue dovetails into personal OPSEC (nice acronym for Operational Security).

Have any of you non-cops ever noticed cops when they go into a restaurant or other public place? Have you ever noticed which seats they chose and how they orient themselves to other people in the place and the doors and windows? Well, that’s all part of situational awareness and OPSEC.

Film at 11.

406, OUT

By: 406

406 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:58:34 +0000

Response has already started. See this link:
http://tinyurl.com/3yh8o6
This is a CNN report about a college student in Utah who started packing after the VA Tech incident. It’s a shame he may be doing so in violation of Utah law (I don’t know Utah law about weapons on campus, but I bet it’s a violation). The decision to refuse to be a victim is a key issue for this young man. I don’t blame him a bit, and I would probably do the same thing.

This site has really good info for those who have or are considering obtaining a carry permit: http://www.usconcealedcarry.com/
Some states with carry permits, mine for instance (TN), do not specify *concealed*. TN has bills in its General Assembly this session that may modify the carry law to allow carry in restaurants that serve alcohol as long as no alcohol is being consumed by the individual carrying. Just an FYI.

A quick search of the net will reveal that there is beginning to be much activity on the student right to carry front. This will only grow – it will not go away.

We shall see what we shall see, but a well qualified populace that scares the bejesus out of a potential mass killer is one aspect of controlling an essentially uncontrollable phenomenon.

406, OUT

By: sevesteen

sevesteen — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 01:13:41 +0000

In Ohio, I’m required to notify immediately whenever stopped for a law enforcement purpose while armed. Some states don’t require notification, but I would anyhow–I don’t want an officer to be surprised by my gun, and I don’t want to be mixed up about the rules in a particular state–It is enough for me to remember which ones accept my licenses.

It is recommended that you tell about the license before you tell that you’ve got a gun. Yelling out “I’ve got a gun!!” might meet the requirements of the statute, but is not likely to generate a positive response from the officer.

By: philosophicalcop

philosophicalcop — Thu, 21 Feb 2008 23:02:12 +0000

My answer is that you should ALWAYS identify yourself and your weapon at once. Nothing but tragedy can come from the opposite response.

By: John

John — Thu, 21 Feb 2008 04:43:19 +0000

Thanks for that PC and Sevesteen. What’s the protocol if you’re carrying and you get pulled over or stopped in the street – are you supposed to let the police know immediately, or only if you’re going to be searched?

John

By: sevesteen

sevesteen — Wed, 20 Feb 2008 04:57:30 +0000

John–I’d like to answer some of your points from the view of a concealed carry license holder. The people with carry licenses are convicted of violent crimes 1/5 to 1/8 as often as the general population. We have to pass a strict criminal background check, and the kind of people willing to go through the process aren’t typically hotheaded. Like Philo said (if he can shorten my handle…) crime goes down when CCW is allowed.

Most police understand that we aren’t the ones they need to worry about.

By: philosophicalcop

philosophicalcop — Wed, 20 Feb 2008 01:14:52 +0000

Good points everyone.

John, I think that your question is an excellent one. All I can say is that the deterrent effect seems to outweigh that concern. In every U.S. State that implements carry laws, violent crime goes DOWN. Also there is a pragmatic element here. We simply cannot hope to get all the guns away from everyone, it will not happen.

Sev,

I see your point. I had not thought about repairs, etc. And indeed my department “owns” me to some degree. I REALLY like your point about the politicians and the slippery slope. If they change their mind later, they will have a list of guns…and don’t EVER apologize for discussing these points with me. That is what this blog is all about!

Arizona…

See me comment above, but I hear you on the follow-up confiscation!